Scoutmaster Podcast 256

I'm Daryl Oakley and I'm an assistant scoutmaster with Troop 1 in Hopeville, Massachusetts. This edition of the Scoutmaster podcast is sponsored by backers like me.

And now the old scoutmaster. Hey, this is a threefer. Listen carefully.

What do you call a scoutmaster with half a brain? Gifted, of course.

What's the difference between a scoutmaster and savings bonds? Well, savings bonds mature right, And one of my scouts said to me: when I grow up, I want to be a scoutmaster. And I said: listen, you can't really have it both ways.

Oh yeah, Well, this is podcast number 256.. Hey, Welcome back to the Scoutmaster podcast. This is Clarke Green looking right into the mailbag, diving right into the mailbag. Let's see. We heard from Lizzie, who said: love your site.

Just started to look at it differently now that I'm about to start a venturing crew. Do you know of any other blogger or website that has a focus on venturing?

Well, Lizzie, I'm in the first few months of getting a newly chartered venturing crew off the ground too. While the program specifics may be different, venturing has more in common with all the other age levels of scouting than differences, And I think everything really translates.

I mean, we're talking about youth leadership, we're talking about the patrol system, which is- you know, just by a different name- and a venturing crew. We're talking about the role of adult volunteers. The educational and advancement system involved, evaluation, all of those things that worked when you were a Cub Scout leader and worked when you were a Boy Scout leader are going to work.

As a venturing leader, You're going to be dealing with older young people, older young people- Well, I guess, I guess, I guess that's right, huh? But so your technique is going to be a little bit different And, like I said, the names of things are going to be different and the activities are going to be more advanced, But the basic, broad, underlying concepts remain the same.

I haven't found anybody who is got like a specific how to do venturing blog, or I know that there are some resources out there that deal with program aspects and procedures and policies And there are some from our own national organization that manage that well. But, like I said, what's really important is that, as a Scouter, no matter where you begin, if you begin as a Tiger Den leader or you begin as a Scoutmaster or a venturing advisor, all of this is translatable. The big stuff all works with every age group. The application is going to change according to the age, and the names of things are going to be different, but the basic principles are all the same.

Over on Amazon, Dennis reviewed my book So Far, So Good- The New Scoutmaster Story, saying it's a really inspirational book for anyone in a leadership role in Scouting. Clark lays out Scouting as it should be in this story that started on his website and finished in its published form. I highly recommend that this be a part of your leader curriculum And I really appreciate the review, Dennis. It means a great deal. If you haven't seen the book yet, it's available on Amazon in paperback.

It's available through scoutmastercgcom for mobile devices in an EPUB format or a Kindle format, So make sure to check that out. Let's see: This past week, since the last podcast, we did a couple of live chats, and the live chats happen at scoutmastercgcom. Keep an eye on our Facebook feed and our Twitter feed for announcements when we'll be doing a live chat. It's usually a weekday mornings between 8 and 1130 or 1230 or however long we end up going.

So check the Facebook feed and the Twitter feed for announcements of when these will be happening. And this week we talked with- this week we talked with Lee Torbush, who's a Scoutmaster in Woodstock, Georgia. Peter LaRue, who's a rover and a former troop scouter from Johannesburg, South Africa. Steve Kaminski is from Midlothian Virginia, and Steve's about to become a Scoutmaster. Kevin is currently a Scoutmaster in the Far East Council with a BSA troop in Taiwan. Ed Bedford is the Scoutmaster of Troop 820 in Chapel Hill, North Carolina.

Gretel Sanong is a relatively new Scoutmaster for Troop 263 in Lakeville, Minnesota. Gary Miller is from Idaho and he's about to take over as a Scoutmaster. David DiMattia was part of the chat and he said he just found out that he'll probably be the troop his troops new Scoutmaster very soon. And Patrick Garrett is an incoming cub master and Pac is going to be the cub master of Pac 1156 in Sterling Virginia And Fred Carroll is Webelos two den leader. Those are all folks who were new to the chat. This past week We had a lot of our who we've come to call frequent flyers check in.

But I wanted to make sure to call the names and the places and the unit numbers and all the great stuff about the people who did check in this week and his way of encouraging you to come and enjoy one of the live chats with us Over on the blog. This week we published a five-part series that is was Thoughts for Cub Scout Leaders, kind of a Cub Scout Leaders survival guide, whatever you want to call it, And we got a lot of response to that and I'm glad people found it useful. One of the things that was discussed in that was the relationship between our units.

Okay, We have separate units, We have Cub Scout packs, Boy Scout troops and venturing crews, And sometimes the way that those units are ministrated make connections a little difficult. Patrick Garrett pointed out something from Baden Powell who wrote the Wolf Cub Handbook, And in that handbook he has some notes for people leading Cub Scouts. It was called Wolf Cubs back when it started but he says a normal Wolf Cub pack is not a separate organization but part of a scout group. The Cub Master should work in close cooperation with the Scouts Scouts, the Senior Scouts and the Rover Scouts. He should make it clear to every new boy and every new boy's parents that the pack is only the anti-room to scouting. You should keep the ideal of a better scout before the Cubs.

At the head of the group there is the group Scoutmaster who exercises general supervision over all sections of the group but delegates the detailed responsibility for the management of each section to the scouter in charge of it. So the original vision, the original way that this worked and the way that it still works in most of the rest of the world, is this group concept where there's a shared structure between all the different age divisions and scouting, And I think one of the parts of this series that I published this week was encouraging scouters in all of our age divisions to really actively communicate with one another and to help each other out, especially our Cubs.

I think there's a lot of things in Cubs that could benefit from. People who were once den leaders or Cub Masters or things like that and moved on to scout troops or venturing crews could be very, very helpful if they remained connected with that Cub Scout pack. One of the posts out of those five was aimed at understanding volunteering, and Tim Giorgi tweeted on that one. He said: ouch, my ears are burning.

Clark is talking about me again, right, Tim? I was talking about us all.

There's some things about volunteering that you know are just kind of self-evident truths. Sometimes We see what we get ourselves into.

That was part of that series, So make sure you check it out over at scoutmastercgcom- Heard from Mac Barron who says: love the series, great insights and very big picture concepts to keep in mind when we're dealing with all the details. I'm not familiar with the song you mentioned, the Here They Are song.

Is there a link to the lyrics or a description of the song? Well, in this series it wasn't my intent to give a whole lot of like very specific program ideas. It was basically to talk about the big picture. Mac, the song. You probably won't find lyrics for it anywhere. Let me tell you exactly how it works.

This is for when the Cubs are coming up on the stage, okay, And when they're returning their seats. So during an awards ceremony, everybody's active and involved and engaged and not just sitting and watching. The tune is the last part of Stars and Stripes Forever And it's really really simple lyrics, two phrases. When they're coming up on the stage, you sing over and over again: Here they are, And when they're leaving the stage, you sing over and over again There they go. At the risk of alienating all of my listenership, I have a recording of the Stars and Stripes Forever. This is how it works.

And you just sing it over and over and over again, Filling the time from when they get up from their seats until they're up on the stage And then when they leave the stage until they get back in their seats. Everybody should be able to understand that now, right, But thanks for getting in touch, Mac, And thanks for the kind words there.

Well, before we go any further, let me take a moment to say: if you're a regular reader and listener and if the resources we've created have helped you, I want to ask you to return the favor by becoming a scoutmastercgcom backer. The funds we get from backers go towards the expenses of producing and publishing the blog posts and the podcasts and all the other resources that we want to keep freely available to everybody. It's easy to do: Go to scoutmastercgcom, Look at the menu right at the top of the page and click the support link And you can choose any level of support, And some of them mean that I'll send you an autograph copy of one of my books. And I'd like to take a moment to personally thank Steve Foy, Edward Guzman, Rick Mark and Steve Jackson, who all became backers since our last podcast. Go to scoutmastercgcom and become a backer this week And I'll be sure to thank you during our next podcast And the remainder of this podcast will be taken up with some email questions that you sent me, And I don't see anything preventing us from proceeding, unless I break into song again, which I promise I promise not to do.

So let's get started, shall we? We're going camping. We're going camping. Write me a letter, Send it my name

Email. That is, folks.

And here's an answer to one of your emails. This email came in within the last week, said: I am a young assistant Scoutmaster in my mid-20s. I find it useful to hear from someone who's been through it all.

Well, not all, but a lot of it. Yeah, Obviously I lack the life experience that most seasoned scouters have, but I'm an Eagle Scout and I think I know the scouting program fairly well. I am the youngest assistant Scoutmaster in our troop and I was able to stay involved with the troop as I went through college. Our current Scoutmaster is ready to step down. All of the older adults are new to the troop and they don't really feel that they wanted to take on the responsibility of becoming a Scoutmaster.

So I was asked to take on the job and I've decided to do so. The biggest challenge that I face is my lack of experience of I'm not a parent and I haven't dealt with parents a whole lot, and I understand the only way to get experience is to, you know, go ahead and jump in. But on the flip side, nobody else was willing to do this and at least I'm willing to give it a shot. I know being a soon-to-be new Scoutmaster is not a unique position, but I've never heard of anyone taking on this role at such a young age. I've always associated the role of Scoutmaster with seasoned, older adults with years of experience.

How can a young guy like me best face the challenges that lie ahead? Well, my friend, I have news for you. I was in my mid-20s- I was only 24 years old in 1984, way back when- when I took over as Scoutmaster and I ended up staying in that role for 30 years.

So let me tell you something. Okay, You'll be fine. Being an older, more experienced parent or adult cuts both ways. It can help sometimes and it can hold you back others, And the same is going to be true of being younger and having no children involved in the in the troop. You'll have a very different perspective from older people with parents who are parents with sons involved in the troop and that perspective can be very, very valuable. I can tell from your email that you've given the whole thing a lot of thought.

You're aware of the challenges you may encounter as a younger Scoutmaster and that kind of self-awareness is an important strength. I'd say it's a key strength.

If you weren't asking these questions of yourself, well then we'd all be concerned. The key thought that I want to share with you- if I had to reduce it down to one key thought, it would be this: the Scoutmaster mentors and guides scouts, but leads the other adults. I rarely give directions to scouts in the same way I would direct another adult. You'll find that adults will appreciate your leadership.

They'll appreciate you being frank and plain in your directions, So don't be afraid to tell them exactly what you'd like them to do and how to do it if needed. They are choosing you to lead them, So take that seriously and exercise your leadership. If you haven't already done it, sit down with the other adults and share your concerns and share what you see as being challenges. Tell them you're honored to have the position, You're aware that you're younger than average and you'll appreciate their help, but in the same breath, tell them that since they've selected you to lead, you'll expect them to follow your lead. Most troops, all the adults involved, we run on I guess what you could call a consensus model. Everybody talks things through and agrees on a way forward, but there's got to be one person who leads the way forward, and that usually turns out to be the Scoutmaster.

So I'll repeat myself: You're going to be fine and I'm very interested to hear how things go. So do keep in touch. I heard from Don Fest, who is an assistant Scoutmaster with a troop in Western New York. He said another leader and I were planning a summer field day type of skills competition. We're thinking about having the big finale event be the alligator river game that you describe in the infographic on your website. We're worried it might not work or that the scouts may not be able to do it.

Have you seen it done? I tried to find a video online but I couldn't. Any thoughts.

Well, yeah, done, The game actually works. Yes, I've seen it done. The key is making sure that the materials you provide and where you're going to play- kind of the field of play- are going to make it possible.

Now, if you're not familiar folks with the alligator river game, I'll have a link to the infographic about that game in the post that contains this podcast at scoutmastercgcom. So my best advice done is testing the game out by trying it out yourself well in advance and making sure that the gear that you're going to have works and the distances work. Plus, you'll know how to offer effective coaching device once you've done it yourself. You're going to need a few people to help you do that, whether it's scouts or adults.

You know that's your choice, But the alligator river game is a little complex and it's something I would definitely want to run before. I tried it as part of an event, And field days are great fun.

The problem sometimes is not going through each event a couple of times in advance, though, And I think it's a great idea to have you and your fellow volunteers go through the events with the materials that you're going to actually use on the day and find any problems by running through things once or twice or three times, And it'll also reveal any issues with scoring or judging that you can iron out before the event If you're going to use the alligator river game as big finish and make a great big finish to a day right. I'd suggest you have a couple of events that develop the required skills earlier on.

Like a chariot race, We have to lash together a triangle, put a patrol member on it and carry them to the goal, and maybe a rope throwing competition for distance and accuracy, since throwing a line is going to be part of finishing the alligator river game. But it sounds like a great idea. Field days are great fun And I look forward to hearing about how it goes. I heard from Larry Faust who said our council camperee committee has said that Webelos cannot attend the camperee. I was a little surprised by this.

Can you set some light or point out resources on this? Larry, what you found in the Cub Scout outdoor guidelines, which is a document from the BSA- I'll link to it in the post that contains this podcast- says this. It said Webelos dens are encouraged to visit Boy Scout camperees and Klondike derbies. The purpose of these visits should be for the Webelos to look ahead with anticipation to their future as Boy Scouts and observe troops they may join. It goes on to say Webelos Scouts should not compete or participate in activities designed for Boy Scouts. Webelos Scouts should not spend the night at the event.

If the program is Boy Scout based, A separate Webelos only event, known as Webelos reee, should be provided by the council or district. With that in mind, why do those policies exist? I'm thinking, when your council camperee committee says Webelos can't attend, they're saying they're not going to be there on the same status as Scouts. You might want to check and see if they can visit, though, And, of course, one of the issues here is age appropriateness, which is a two way street when it comes to this right.

We want to have Webelos interacting with scout troops. We don't necessarily want to have Webelos being an integral part of a scout based event like camperee or Klondike derby or something like that, Because, like I said, it's a two way street. We don't want Webelos participating in activities that are beyond their capacity, And we don't want Scouts to feel as though their space is being invaded by the quote little kids unquote.

Now, though, those are important considerations. We have an annual father and son weekend with our troop that we invite Webelos and their fathers to attend And we have them participate in the activities, But we have activities specifically designed for Webelos: dance, okay, apart from our scout patrols. They're similar activities, but their age appropriate to Webelos And we also maintain an appropriate division between the ages.

So, like I said, the Scouts don't feel that their space is being invaded. It's not that difficult to do, And when you sit down with a program and you think it through, those are a couple of considerations that you want to make.

This email from someone who asked that they remain anonymous says we have a scout who is a cancer survivor. His overall health is frail right now And the cancer has left him with a permanent disability. He's able to attend most of our troop meetings, but camping and hiking are strenuous for him and generally beyond his capacity. All of this means he's behind Scouts of the same age in advancement. I don't want to lose him to being frustrated because of his inability to handle some of the outdoor components of the program.

Do you have any advice for me? Well, yes, First of all, it's impossible for Scouts to get behind Now. Yes, they may be generally farther back than the other guys in their age group And I know that can be frustrating for them. But let's just begin with the premise: it's really impossible for a scout to be behind when it comes to advancement. Keeping that in mind, let's get a copy of the guide to advancement and look at section ready, ready. Here it comes: 10.2.2.1..

And this section is entitled using alternative requirements. So I'm quoting right from that section: a degree of modification in advancement requirements may be necessary to mainstream as many members with disabilities as possible. Thus, a scout with a permanent physical or mental disability or a disability expected to last more than two years or beyond his 18th birthday, who was unable to complete all the requirements for tender foot second class or first class rank may, with his parent or guardian and also the unit leader or a member of the troop committee, submit a request to the council advancement committee to complete alternative requirements. Simple modifications very close to existing requirements need not be approved by the council advancement committee. For example, a scout in a wheelchair may meet the second class requirement for hiking by wheeling to a place of interest. Allowing more time and permitting special aids are also ways leaders can help scouts with disabilities make progress.

Modifications, however, must provide a very similar challenge and learning experience. So that's directly out of the guide to advancement And the scout you describe would qualify for the modified requirements is having it because he has a permanent physical disability And he also has the ongoing medical concerns, and in the guide they mentioned ones that are going to last 18 months or more.

So I would go over the applicable sections of the guide to advancement and school myself on exactly how to make this happen. Sit down with the scout, perhaps one of his parents and a member of your troop committee, identify the requirements that need modification for this scout, define those modifications, come up with a plan that helps him meet the modified requirements, and then move on to get permission for those modifications from your council advancement committee. It should be a fairly straightforward process And you'll find, like I said, excellent guidance about exactly how to do that in the guide to advancement. I also have this email from Kyle Burkholder, who said: I'm currently transitioning from advancement chair to Scoutmaster And one of the things I would like to present to the scouts to change is meeting all year long instead of just during the school year.

I believe that having an all year long program is good, but I'm not sure how to make the change and any advice would be appreciated. Well, Kyle, I think you hit the nail on the head.

Having a year round program is an excellent idea And I think it's one that most all of us expect will happen. We've had a year round program for a long, long time And we understand that during the summer months, because of family vacations and other commitments and things like that, that attendance is going to be a little spotty. Our summer meetings are a lot more casual. Sometimes they just play games during that whole meeting. We've moved those meetings to a local park where there's plenty of room to run around And, like I said, we focus on more casual outdoor activities than a formal meeting.

Now, from your email it sounds like you want to present this to the scouts so that they can make a decision on it, which is a very laudable thought, because of course we want the scouts to be invested in leading their own troop and everything like that. But I don't necessarily think that this is a scout decision quite so much as a decision from you and the troop committee that you're going to add to the schedule and have a year round schedule that goes through the summer month, because you're going to need the adult support of making those meetings happen and everything like that.

So I would begin there and then I would take it to the scouts and say, look, we're ready to put some things on our schedule for the summer and I'm really excited about it and I would really like to see it work. What do you guys think?

And you know I could foresee them going not really interested and I could foresee them being very excited about it, but I would put it on the schedule and I would encourage attendance. You know, understanding, of course, that during the summer months there's going to be a lot of commitments that may draw them away from it and see how it goes.

So, Kyle, I hope that helps. Before we move on, I want to remind you how important it is to understand that what you hear on the podcast is what I have to say about something, And when there are questions of policy and procedure, I do my best to get it right. But don't stop here.

Okay, you run to the resources yourself too, And I'll often mention them as part of the podcast, and there are two mentioned in this podcast. One is the Cub Scout outdoor guide, The other one is the guide to advancement, which is frequently mentioned here.

Now get a copy of both of those. They're both available as PDF documents, Read them and familiarize yourself with them.

I'm not saying that you have to memorize them or anything like that, but familiarize yourself with them so that, when questions arise, you'll have an instant road to a resource that will help you answer that question and you'll be confident that you're doing things according to policy and procedure, Or you'll see that the issue you're concerned about is left up to your own common sense application. So if you end up with a question or concern that you would like some help with, you can get in touch with me. It's pretty easy to do and you're going to find out how to do that in just a moment.