Scoutmaster Podcast 189

And now it's the old Scoutmaster. Hi Clark, My name is Cameron Smith. I am a Scoutmaster from 51 in the Nesta Hotel And I had something kind of rare that I wanted to just run by quick. You see, I'm relatively new as a Scoutmaster, but it hasn't taken long since I've become a Scoutmaster that I started to have this dozen urge to grow a beard. I can't explain it, but it was real.

I had this real urge to grow a beard, So I gave it some time. I grew a beard, And then I go to camp. I couldn't help but notice that there's a lot of Scoutmasters that were sporting beards.

We go back from camp, I'm going to council functions here and there And sure enough, I'm seeing a lot of guys working beards. Is beard growing a side effect being a Scoutmaster?

Or is it nearly that bearded men are more prone to being Scoutmasters? Or is the fact that I am allowing such a goofy question to consume my mind proof that I am suffering from some sort of rare Scoutmaster mental illness? I'm not sure, but I figured if anybody knew it would have to be Mr Parker.

So keep up the good work. I love your podcast and your scout circles are pretty awesome. Thank you very much, Cameron.

I think he got something there. It's not a mental illness, It's called a state of mind. If you have an answer to any of Cameron's several questions or concerns there, you can call and leave a message and it might be on a future podcast.

So call 484-734-0002.. 484-734-0002.. See if you can give Cameron a hand.

Hey, this is podcast number 189.. Welcome back to the Scoutmaster Podcast. This is Clark Greene. Let's take a look at the mailbag. Got a lot in the mailbag this week. Bill Daniel wrote in and said this: Scouts will give you great insight if you listen.

Once I had a parent tell me that the patrol leader reacted to my presence by saying: good, the Scoutmaster is here, He won't let the assistant Scoutmasters tell us what to do. That made me feel appreciated and even a little vindicated. Another scout was running for senior patrol leader and he stated that his goal would be to make patrols more than a place to stand in line.

Now that gave me the message that it took several years to digest. We had moved down the path to being boy led. We had a strong troop, Yet our patrols were simply kind of this administrative label in a troop organization chart, What I inherited and blindly accepted.

You know it seemed to be working, but I knew that it needed to be examined and questioned. Your podcast has given me much pause about this and the patrol method. We've changed from scientifically engineered, adult concocted patrols that are ones of the scout's own choosing. I readily accept that my job as Scoutmaster is to remove obstacles and enable scouts to be scouts.

Now my challenge is to get the scouts to move forward and even so that they notice these obstacles for themselves and they have the freedom of new thoughts leading to new actions and new achievements. Bill, thanks so much for that And I'm always excited and encouraged to hear that people are making sense out of all this. Thanks again, Bill, Over on Stitchercom, which is a great way to listen to the podcast if you on any mobile device. Stitchercom Howard left us this review. He said the podcast does a great job of providing assistance to Scoutmasters in particular, but really anyone who's working as a leader or a volunteer or the parent of a scout. Clark explains difficult concepts clearly.

He answers questions from rookie and veteran leaders alike. He has fascinating stories to tell. Really, I've recommended his show to a number of scout leaders and they thank me for introducing him to it and all he has to offer.

Wow, Howard, thank you so much. I really appreciate the kind words there. Don Mitchell is in Troop 1 in Huntington Beach, California. He says I love the podcast and the website. They're great resources. I often forward items along to the other folks in the troop.

I've been listening to them directly from the website and I like the links you provide on the show notes. Anyway, on your end, to make things work a little bit better, it would be great if I could play the podcast in a new window. That way I could keep browsing and look at the references that you refer to or look at a blog entry. I'm finding this kind of difficult to do right now. Thanks, and keep up the good work.

Well, John, I've got great news for you. I've spent some time putting together a new podcast archive and from here on out, I'm going to publish the podcast.

Make sure that they have a very clear way of opening them up in a new window so you can browse the website and listen to the podcast at the same time. I think I've improved the ability of people to be able to download past podcasts. Make that a little bit simpler.

So go to scoutmastercgcom. Right there at the top of the page In the main menu is the podcast archive. Take a look at that and tell me if that solves the problem for you. Hey, John, you're far from alone.

I've had a number of requests over time to add these features and I think I got it worked out finally. So check out the podcast archive and let me know. John Wiebke is in Zionsville, Indiana with troop 358.. He said thanks again for the inspiration and knowledge passed on in the podcast articles and resources.

I'm beside myself finding so much good information about your experiences in Algonquin Provincial Park in Ontario, Canada, because our troop is going to be traveling there next summer. Well, John, you're going to really love Algonquin and I'm glad that you're finding the information that we've shared about our annual canoe trips useful. And have a great trip next summer And make sure to tell us about it.

So before we get started here, let me remind you that our next scout circle is Sunday, October 13th, from 9 to 10 pm. What is scout circle, you ask? Scout circle is a live video presentation.

We have a guest on and they do their presentation and then we open up for questions and you can send a question by email. And this October scout circle, the subject is backpacking And our guest is Joe Jacaruso from gossamergearcom. Joe's an experienced scouter who's led a lot of scout backpacking trips, and the subject is scouts and backpacking. That's Sunday, October 13th, from 9 to 10 pm at scoutsircleorg.

Scoutsircleorg, In this podcast in just a moment, we're going to talk about what happens when Webelos visit your troop meeting, and then we have some e-mail questions to answer and that's going to take up the rest of the podcast. So let's get started.

Shall we Show master'ship in seven minutes or less? So over the next couple of months you're going to start getting requests for second-year Webelos then to come visit your scout troop. Over the years we've been all over the map about how to do this.

In our troop We've had very formal presentations with lots of paperwork and handouts and PowerPoint, and you know we've done our best to put the poor parents that come to visit us to sleep. So over the next couple of months, you're going to start getting requests for the poor parents that come to visit us to sleep.

So What I've hit on is a method that I want to share with you and you may find it effective too When the Webelos and their parents come to visit. We have a couple of our scouts are ready to work with the Webelos for the entirety of the meeting. They have a couple of things planned for them. They get them to participate in whatever the troop is doing.

They'll play some games and generally have a good time, and take the parents over to a separate room and sit them down and we have a pretty informal conversation with them. We let them ask questions about the troop.

You know we introduced the troop adult leadership at some point early on. While the committee chairman is talking with the parents, I will leave the room, go out and I will find a scout that joined the troop this past year.

So I get a first year scout- It doesn't really matter who- and I ask him. If he has a couple of minutes to ask me, I bring him in and I introduce him to the parents and I say: here's John. He joined the troop February of last year and the best way to learn about the experience for a scout in our troop is to talk to the scouts.

So you've got about five minutes to ask John some questions and sometimes it's a little slow to get started. So I help them out a little bit. I ask John a couple of questions from them, but parents get the idea and they start asking questions and they would not necessarily ask an adult leader.

Well, how do the older scouts treat? How are you doing with advancement? Do you enjoy going camping and what was summer camp like, and things like that.

So once they're talking with that first year scout, I leave the room again and I find a second year scout and this process goes on and each one of them has about five minutes or so with the parents who are attending that meeting. I'll get a scout representative of X number of years in the troop.

I'll bring them in, let the parents talk to them for a while- and you know I try and listen to some of those questions and if there are subjects that come up, we'll expand on those a little bit once we have a chance. Majority of the time that the parents are going to spend visiting our troop meeting they'll be talking to our scouts. I don't tell the scouts to expect this and compare them for it in any way.

I just kind of let them go in cold and we give them a couple of quick words of explanation about who these people are that they're talking to, and a couple of guys have done it several times now and so they understand what goes on. But it works really really well and it gives people a very good picture of what goes on in your troop.

Now, since we started doing this- and I guess it's maybe three or four years that we've been doing this- every time we've done this, at least one or two of the Webelos that are visiting to join the troop- and a lot of times we'd get the whole group, but I don't think we've ever missed getting at least one of them. That's one take on managing the Webelos den visit.

Love to hear what you have to say about it, so make sure you get in touch and you'll find out how to do that at the end of the podcast.

Round the roll, round the roll, round the reed round the roll. Come join my happy song,

Find me a letter, send it by name. Email that is, folks, and here's an answer to one of your emails.

So this week we heard from Brian in centerville, georgia, with troop 400, and Brian had this to say: he said: thanks for all your posts. They always seem right on the point. As the outdoor activities committee chair, I've been working with patrols and the senior patrol leader encouraging the plan patrol activities. I found that because of some of the youth protection rules, our scouts kind of face this catch 22.

We want them to do these things independently and doing them on their own, but apparently we have to have two adults there, right? So my question is is: how does 2d leadership work for patrol activities? For example, one of our patrollers wanted to have a video game night at his home. I was really not too sure if he would be able to do that or not without a couple of adult leaders present.

And I'm also curious as to whether or not these type of plans should be vetted through the Scoutmaster, or can patrols just make this happen? While I support the idea of youth protection, these rules sometimes seem to hinder opportunities and frankly, I think things were a lot easier and simpler in the old days.

Well, Brian, the first rule on questions like this is: we run to the resource, and the resource for this question is the guide to safe scouting, and right there on page one, under the heading scoutings- barriers to abuse, you're going to find this: 2d leadership on all outings is required. We've registered adult leaders, or one registered adult leader and a parent of a participating scout or other adult, one of whom must be 21 years of age or older, are required for all trips and outings. There are a few instances, such as patrol activities, when the presence of adult leaders is not required and adult leadership may be limited to training and guidance of patrol leadership. With the proper training, guidance and approval by the troop leaders, the patrol can conduct day hikes and service projects. Appropriate leadership must be present for all overnight scouting activities. There's your answer, Brian.

A day or an evening activity like the video game night you describe does not need to adults present, as long as your patrol leader has the proper training, guidance and approval. But let's be clear about this: all overnight activities has to have to deep leadership, as described in youth protection policies. All that needs to happen, in my humble opinion, is to talk with patrol ears and describe the policy, ask them how they will make sure that the policy is followed and make whatever modifications you think are required to their plans. In the example that you gave, a video night at a scouts home.

Well, that sounds great. So what would a patrol leader need to know and what training, guidance and approval should he have before he does this activity? The simple concept is that if it's a Boy Scout gathering, whether it's a patrol or a troop, whether it's something casual like a video night at a scouts home or something formal like camp out, it's our obligation to keep things safe and appropriate. I would spend some time with your patrol and get them to think this through. They would want to do things like ask permission of the host parents. They want to discuss the kind of activities they would be doing, how long they would be doing them.

Are they going to need any facilities or food or anything like that? And then, once they've discussed that with the host parents, they need to make sure that they have approval from the troop.

And you know, somebody might want to pick up the phone and call the host parents just to make sure that they know that this is going on. I think it's all really pretty simple and common sense. It's probably 10 minutes worth of planning and discussion. You said that you were worried that these rules sometimes hinder opportunities and the things were much easier and simpler in the old days. But I'm going to disagree with you if you really want to hinder possibilities. Watch what happens if the scout gets injured or some kind of inappropriate activity goes on.

Now, perhaps in the old days you know, 99 out of 100 times it was really that simple and we didn't need any rules. But the one time that a scout was injured or abused, it got complicated. You don't need a whole lot of imagination to see how something as simple as the video game night could go south pretty quickly.

So does 10 minutes of thinking and planning and having those plans vetted for obvious safety or propriety concerns make things all that much difficult? I don't think so. It's just good common sense, and folks that don't exercise that type of common sense can end up in a real mess on their hands.

Youth protection rules are there to do what? To protect our youth, not to complicate things or to hinder scouts from doing what they want to do.

You know the host parents and the adults who are going to make things like this possible. You know drivers and things like that.

I think a quick word from the Scoutmaster is a good idea. Encourage them to let the scouts do everything for themselves. Tell them that the scouts are going to be troubled to ask if they need help. Tell them to observe from a distance. Give them a contact number to call if they have any questions. Barb Higgins is in Hurlock, Maryland, with troop 167.

She said your post about the five basic patrol fundamentals was received at a perfect time for us. We've got a small troop of seven boys, ages 11 through 14, and we go camping every month.

So how do we do the patrol system in such a small troop? We've got two patrols right now, but it doesn't seem to work all that well and we know that it's not right to put everybody together in one patrol, because then we don't have the patrol method. I understand what you're saying about the patrol method. It's a large troop, but with a troop of seven I just don't see how to make it work.

Well, Barb, the answer is very, very simple. With seven scouts you have one patrol. There's no need for multiple patrols at all.

So you don't need a senior patrol leader or troop officers and that wise. All you need is a patrol leader and then everybody in the patrol with only seven boys is always going to have some kind of responsibility to do. You can have a patrol scribe and a patrol quartermaster and a cook and a fire builder and all that kind of great stuff and all the scouts will be pulling in the same direction and they might want to end up electing a new patrol leader a little more often than you might have it done in a troop. They may want to do that every three or four months. Whatever works for them to achieve the aims of the patrol method is what you need to apply. Don't think that you have to have a big formal by the book troop setup with just a seven or a dozen scouts.

Perhaps that's a goal for them as the troop grows. But for now you know they can function very well as one patrol and they're going to have a great time doing it. And when they do, their friends are going to find out and pretty soon you're going to go beyond seven scouts. Dave Schmidt is with troop 201 in Pratt Kansas. He says I am a new Scoutmaster and I trust our scouts to take home the information that's disseminated to them at troop meetings and tell their parents about it. But I understand that sometimes it doesn't always work that way.

So I was thinking of some kind of newsletter or something like that, but I'm no good at that sort of thing. Can you suggest a template or a website that I could use. Dave, you don't need a template, you don't need a website. What you need as a scout to publish your newsletter right.

So at the next troop meeting, go to the scouts, say I think it would be useful for us to have a little one page newsletter. Who would like to publish it? And you're going to find that one of your scouts is going to be pretty excited about doing that.

And you know, when it comes to computers and publishing and printing and things like that, you know they know a whole lot more than we do. To begin with this next question, I'm withholding the personal information at the sender's request. The question says this: tonight was a big night. We had our senior patrol leader election, the reconfiguration of patrols and patrol leader elections. The last podcast could not have been more timely. You made it clear to me that this is a process for the scouts.

We let them decide about patrols and we shouldn't be stepping into, configure patrols or point youth leaders. Now I have my in my mind what a good configuration of patrols would be, but I kept my mouth shut, confident that my role as Scoutmaster was to sit back and observe our newly elected senior patrol leader circled up with the senior scouts and made up the patrols. They did what a lot of adults would do: they balanced numbers and ranks and ages and separated the boys who hadn't gotten along in the past.

Now they did all this while I was doing something else, so I didn't really see what they were up to. When I looked at the result, I saw some really disappointed faces where friendships had been separated, and I think some of our older scouts felt like they had been taken down a peg or two by being assigned to a patrol with the youngest scouts. I asked the senior patrol leader if they let the scouts have their choice of patrol or whether they did all the arranging. They said that they had worked it out themselves and they really hadn't asked the scouts.

I was hesitant to intervene any further, so I just nodded my head and kept my mouth shut. So my question is this: what do you do when the youth leaders do something that you say adults shouldn't do? If I step in and I vetoed the new patrol assignments, it would undermine and embarrass the new senior patrol leader, but if I don't step in, it looks like there's going to be some unhappy scouts.

Well, first and foremost, good idea for nodding your head and keeping your mouth shut. You get a medal for that in that kind of a situation. I congratulate you for your extraordinary self control and forethought.

I would say that right now you've got one of the best opportunities to work the patrol method and to help develop your youth leadership. Before the next meeting, sit down with your senior patrol leader and ask him to observe carefully during that meeting and look at the way the patrols are working and see how well the choices that he made for the scouts are being accepted.

Do your own observation and keep your own notes during the meeting and then sit down with the senior patrol leader again and ask him if he saw the same things that you did. Maybe you saw a scout leave his patrol and go hang out with his friend and the other patrol, or something like that. If there's a problem with the choices that the senior patrol leader made and making up the patrols, it's going to be pretty apparent and you have the perfect opportunity to help him see through these things and maybe see where he went wrong and you can ask him a lot of questions about it.

You know you decided who would be in what patrol. Do you think it might be a better idea to let the scouts make those decisions. Ask him how he would feel if somebody decided to split up the troop and he and his friends ended up in separate troops.

I think it's a great opportunity and, honestly, I love it. When this type of stuff happens in my own troop. It gives me the chance to work with my youth leaders and ask questions that hopefully lead them to a point of discovery and they figure out how to fix things.

Now, if you decide to follow that advice, I'd love to hear how it goes. So keep in touch. You can get in touch with me if you have a question, and you're going to find out how to do that in just a moment.